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Thread: STIC jetting thread:

  1. #1761
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    Default Re: STIC jetting thread:

    I ordered a white needle as $10 plus paying for shipping of blue needle back didn't make sense. I use the N3EJ currently on clip#2. I could manage the Red on clip 2 but running with the Yam needle and liking it. That 1st 10% leaves something to be desired and my plug confirms it. I will report back once I get some hours on the white needle. If it cleans up the bottom and keeps all else the same it will be perfect. Heading to some good mountain single track next week so excited to see how it does....sick of this FL sugar sand all the time.
    -2019 KTM 250 XC
    RK head, Keihin, STIC, Gnarly/Turbinecore, Kreft
    -2019 KTM 690 Enduro
    -2020 Sherco 300 SEF Factory

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  3. #1762
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    Default Re: STIC jetting thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by sfade View Post
    I ordered a white needle as $10 plus paying for shipping of blue needle back didn't make sense. I use the N3EJ currently on clip#2. I could manage the Red on clip 2 but running with the Yam needle and liking it. That 1st 10% leaves something to be desired and my plug confirms it. I will report back once I get some hours on the white needle. If it cleans up the bottom and keeps all else the same it will be perfect. Heading to some good mountain single track next week so excited to see how it does....sick of this FL sugar sand all the time.
    All you have to do is contact me at vortex@sticfuel.us

  4. #1763
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    Default Re: STIC jetting thread:

    Newsletter #101 STIC mileage

    The question; does the STIC use more fuel? The answer is no, it does not. If you control the throttle the STIC gets better mileage; if you want to ride it wide open under adverse conditions, expect it to use more fuel. We have conducted milage test using precise measured fuel containers and holding both tests at a precise miles per hour (mph). When addressing fuel milage, it depends on how you use and ride the bike. The better performance and mileage is attributed to the STIC’s better emulsification (mixing of air with the fuel in the tube) versus the stock carburetors that tend to merge raw fuel with the main air stream.

    STIC retrofits a lot of the aftermarket carburetors with the STIC concept. Some of the automotive carburetors already have a high degree of emulsification, such as Weber’s, Holley’s, the Dellorto, Bing and some four-stroke motorcycle carburetors by Keihin, Mikuni, and other lesser known carburetors. The STIC methodology is a totally new process that has been added to the mentioned automotive carburetors with great success, showing a 30 to 40hp gain.

    In the case of motocross and other motorcycles, most aftermarket carburetors only merge raw fuel with the main bore air; although there is a degree of fuel break-up as the fuel is broken by the flat backside of the needle used in some aftermarket carburetors. The STIC potentially can and does use larger main and pilot jets. However, the STIC jet tube diameter along with the needle diameter determines the fuel outlet size into the carburetor’s main airstream. The STIC outlet size and the needle combination is substantially smaller than the stock Keihin.

    The stock Keihin has a tube outlet of .1142” and a stock needle diameter of .1060” with a difference of .0082.” The STIC tube outlet is .1129” (.113A) and the Red needle (II II) diameter is .1072” with a difference of .0057,” thus, the STIC has a smaller diameter by minus (-) .0025.” With the new “white” needle diameter of .1082,” the difference from the tube to the needle is .0047.” the STIC passage is .0035” smaller than the stock Keihin. Ultimately, the STIC with the larger main jet has a larger column of fuel to pull from, however, the STIC’s final metering (orifice to needle) is substantially smaller than the stock Keihin by minus (-) .0035.”

    Bottom line, is it the STIC’s emulsification or is the STIC’s series of patented passages that makes the STIC more efficient in its greater fuel delivery through smaller orifices? We know it is the STIC’s methodology of higher emulsification, vaporization, and cooling of the mixture that causes the STIC’s air fuel mixture to have more kinetic energy and this makes the engine more efficient with less fuel.
    Last edited by STIC Fuel Systems; 10-17-2020 at 04:34 PM.

  5. #1764
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    Default Re: STIC jetting thread:

    Newsletter #104 (new “White” needle details)

    The STIC is designed to have a super aggressive acceleration enrichment in all positions including the instant low speed window as well as all positions to wide open. This has led some riders to complain of a richness in the first 10% of throttle movement. To tame the STIC aggressive system down; a new “white” needle has been developed by James from JD Jetting; this needle is not available by itself, however, it is available in the JD Jetting kit made for the STIC Metering block. For those that have already purchased the kit from JD, STIC, or other distributors, and find the JD Blue (IIII) needle to be too rich, JD has an exchange program that allows those that have the Blue (IIII) needle to send it to JD along with $10.00 (to cover Shipping and handling); then you will receive the new “white” needle at no charge. STIC Headquarters offers the same program and may be contacted at vortex@sticfuel.us or you may call STIC at 715-479-7822.

    In order for an internal combustion engine that is carbureted or with fuel injection to accelerate, there must be a momentary enrichment of the fuel mixture, this can be accomplished in several ways, the addition of an accelerator pump, wings, restrictive reed cages, richer slides, smaller carburetor bores, and other features. Without the use of an accelerator pump there are other ways to do this. STIC invented a method that senses an increase in the intake pressure to cause the differential pressure to increase (a lower pressure drop), this causes more fuel to flow from the STIC’s tube outer chamber (acceleration well) to discharge into the throttle bore.

    The STIC’s aggressive acceleration feature is enhanced by the Keihin air striker with its two-vortex wings, they are designed to cause intense directional air flow surrounding the tube outlet thus, increasing the differential pressure drop. The use of the vortex direction wings in a carburetor on both sides of the exit was first conceived by Boswell in patent number 5,386,145, filed during 1993: section 15, referring to fig 15, 16, “…. The optional vortex generator… provides enhanced air fuel mixing and air flow characteristics over the air flow surface….” The Boswell patent issued during January 1995.

    Here is the point; the STIC metering process creates extremely high differential low pressure drop at the jet tube exit that is very intense, and with the Keihin’s enhanced directional vortex generators being directed toward and near the tube outlet, this causes the surrounding directional spinning air flow spirals to exit near the tube outlet. The modification enlarging the slot on the backside of the slide, although it will enhance the signal strength of a regular carburetor without the STIC, it is not recommended when using the STIC. The modified larger slot is directly behind the tube outlet thus increasing the signal strength on an already aggressive STIC metering and acceleration system. Although it may work well on carburetors with weaker differential pressure, it is not recommended for the STIC process.

    The STIC process has several aggressive features; the idle/intermediate (the pilot jet) merges with the main jet just off idle, this feature allows instant transition from the idle/intermediate to the main circuit, and from the main back to the idle/intermediate. The other feature that many of you like, the STIC has an instant pressurized acceleration feature that is active just off idle and is available in every other throttle position including wide open. The STIC pressurized acceleration feature is extremely aggressive and is hair triggered with the slightest throttle movement; thus, excessive air flow directly behind the STIC jet tube in the low speeds will activate the acceleration feature and is a contributing factor to the richness that we are discussing. Ultimately, it is recommended that slides with no modification to the back side be utilized along with the new “white” JD needle made for the STIC metering system.
    Last edited by STIC Fuel Systems; Yesterday at 01:45 PM.

  6. #1765
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    Default Re: STIC jetting thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by Powerban View Post
    UNREAL! Not changing anything but putting a 200 in for the main, once again transformed a tune I thought was great into a whole new animal that is far superior! I’m very pleased with these results! I don’t see TPI being a thing of interest for me at this point; there’s no way I can accept performance subpar to what STIC is producing. This is the new standard, without a doubt. Especially since I’ve been at different altitudes with my previous inefficient settings; with no change in performance, not huge elevation differences but enough to cause a problem with a Keihin/Mikuni Metering Block (around 1200ft-4500ft) ... I want to change up the pilot and needle clip settings yet just to see what happens with this 200 main Jet setup.

    Other needles I have and want to test yet but can’t get to because I keep improving setup; with performance still left on the table with my current NEDK,
    NOZH - KTM
    NOZI - KTM
    N1EH - KTM
    N8RH - KTM
    NEDH - Suzuki
    NECH - Suzuki
    NECJ - Suzuki
    N3EJ - Yamaha (want to go back to this with new knowledge and compare needles for which one has the best performance)
    I has always been good, however, the STIC is really good with the new "white" JD Needle

    A earlier posting using the Suzuki needles is eclipsed by the new JD "white" needle that replaces the rare Suzuki needles that were used during this earlier test by Powerban. The new "white" STIC needle fits in between the sweet spot with a special design by James from JD, thus, the STIC is now really good. Call for free exchange of the JD Blue (IIII) needle; you only pay postage and handling ($10:00).

    CaLL 715-479-7822 or email me at vortex@sticfuel.us
    Last edited by STIC Fuel Systems; Yesterday at 04:06 PM.

  7. #1766
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    Default Re: STIC jetting thread:

    have not read everything about White needle but how wouild it affect a 150's power

    currently happy with red #4
    2016 ktm 150sx set-up for mx & offroad

  8. #1767
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    Default Re: STIC jetting thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by ktmark View Post
    have not read everything about White needle but how would it affect a 150's power

    currently happy with red #4
    If you are happy with the JD Red (II II) STIC needle, that is great. The "white" needle is leaner in the straight section (it is similar to the rare Suzuki needles) and the tip is a few thousandths larger .058" versus .055," so, it uniquely fills a void that was not available. We have a lot of customers that are happy with the Red (II II) needle, it was primarily designed for the 125cc through 500cc market. It's your choice as the blue needle (IIII) would probably be too rich for the 150cc. Let me know.

    The following are using the Red (II II) needle, 125cc, ESR 325, and the 300cc. It was developed for those that were running 250 to 300's and doing low speed finesse riding in the 10% throttle position; this is right at the point where the STIC is starting to blend the pilot jet in with the main jet and at the same time the STIC acceleration feature is starting to engage. As you can see, the Dirt Bike TV 300 was running the Red (II II) STIC needle in the #2 Clip, and we wanted to use the "white" needle to start in the # 3 clip to allow greater tuning flexibility. All were running the air screw at 3 and 1/2 turns out. As you probably know, the STIC is very forgiving in the jetting and needle selection. However, for those riders like yourself that want maximum performance we wanted to give you greater tuning adjustments by allowing the rider to start the "white" needle in the 3rd clip.

    Dirt Bike TV (in the mountains demonstrating prolonged low speed finesse). Notice this 300 with the STIC metering system with the180 main, #50 pilot jet and JD Red (II II) STIC needle (second clip) does not load up during the prolonged low-speed descent of over 2,00 feet, and it is running cleaner than the stock Keihin with the JD Jetting kit.

    Dirt Bike TV KTM 300
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-SYUq1AiYw

    Dirt N Iron 2020 YZ125 Trail (same Jetting as MX)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-0b57Lxyck&t=620s

    Dirt N Iron 2020 YZ 125 MX Track
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9eNzk-5yq8&t=314s

    Dirt N Iron 2020 YZ125X trail with Pro-Rider evaluation
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSkOX5KYpjU&t=6s

    125 STIC (The STIC carburetor is stock out of the box) against Modified 125
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKC2owTm3LU&t=197s
    Last edited by STIC Fuel Systems; Yesterday at 09:11 PM.

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